Is There Anything Beyond the Mind? – Sadhguru at THiNK 2012
At the recent conference THiNK, organized by Tehelka, Sadhguru headed a session with lyricist and scriptwriter Javed Akhtar entitled “Faith, Reason and Inner Engineering”. Led by moderator Shoma Chaudhury, managing editor of Tehelka, the discussion looked into questions on belief, rational thinking and the nature of the mind.
 
THiNK-2012
 

At the recent conference THiNK, organized by Tehelka, Sadhguru headed a session with lyricist and scriptwriter Javed Akhtar, entitled “Faith, Reason and Inner Engineering”. Led by moderator Shoma Chaudhury, managing editor of Tehelka, the discussion looked into questions on belief, rational thinking and the nature of the mind.

While Ms. Chaudhury questioned both Sadhguru and Javed Akhtar on several topics, the theme of the discussion centered on whether there was a dimension beyond the mind. Both lines of discussion – one from Sadhguru and the other from Javed Akhtar – seemed to run parallel, in the sense that they never met in agreement.

The ultra-rationalist Javed insisted that everything comes from the mind, while Sadhguru emphasized that logic was limited when compared with the larger sphere of life. He went on to mention that throughout history, the limits of reality have been pushed by those who dared to think outside the boundaries of contemporary “wisdom”. When asked by the moderator whether in light of these historical precedents, there isn’t room for something beyond the mind, Mr. Akhtar lived up to his reputation as a hard-nosed skeptic by saying that everything is the mind ultimately.

The nature of the mind and our perception of reality played a key role in the rest of the discussion, with other topics including fake gurus, human aspiration and science vs. spirituality. Sadhguru concluded by saying that science and spirituality have never been head on with each other, both looking to test and explore the boundaries of human perception. Mr. Akhtar unfortunately didn't seem too pleased by the way things ended though, because the session closed with him storming off in a huff.

 
 
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5 years 8 months ago

i think sadhguru would have instead played a golf game.instead of wasting time like this :) sadhguru.... we know how tirelessly he is working for us... these people are taking sadhguru's time by inviting him to argue with a pity guy.. my god....

5 years 8 months ago

This is excellent show between an Enlightened human and an intellegent successfull human and what a contrast, Javed looked absolutely mediocre. His body language his brain level, his listening skills every aspect looked so weak. I could clearly see that any Isha volunteer could be sent to do debate with Javed, Sadhguu is too strong for Javed, It was no match.

5 years 7 months ago

Spirituals "leaders" like these have mastered the art of articulating contrived and convoluted mumbo jumbo when in reality they have always been and will be non entities in the sphere of human advancement. This self annihilation might appeal to pathetic human beings always eager on finding and creating new gods but is abhorrent and equivalent to slavery to a man (or a woman) of reason. They try their best to twist words and reconcile with the superior and evidently the only way of thought to acquire and advance knowledge - science, while science happily chugs along, completely unaware of this extended begging hand of reconcilation.

5 years 8 months ago

"Spirituality is the debris of religion"- javed akhtar. I am astounded at the very ignorance, arrogance, authority and sheer irresponsibility with which influential people in society speak. May common sense prevail.

5 years 8 months ago

Oh God! Funny Javed! :-/

5 years 7 months ago

It is awesome Sadhguru gets into these debates. It might never help Mr. Javed Akhtar. It is definitely going to help a lot of other people who are "rational" if they look at it carefully. I am sure Mr. Javed has doubts in his mind if he is missing something though he may not admit it to even himself. I hope Isha can get a debate with Richard Dawkins.

5 years 8 months ago

I always refrain myself from saying something negative about a particular person. However, i have to comment about akthar.. I saw this video long back (few months).. I lost even the last iota of respect I had for this guy javed akthar.. boasting about himself and his so called rationalism. If mind and senses are everything, then how in the world can he explain a concept like 'phantom limbs'.. he is utter crap.. one need not be an intellect to understand that we are more than the mind and the senses..

5 years 8 months ago

I LEARNED HOW TO NOT LOSE ONES COOL WHEN SOMEONE IRRITATES YOU. SADHGURU DID NOT LOSE HIS PATIENCE OR BALANCE IN THIS WHOLE TALK. IT I HAD BEEN IN SUCH A SITUATION I WOULD HAVE GOT EMOTIONAL. THANKS SADHGURU.

5 years 7 months ago

Kudos to Indian culture. Kudos to Sadguru for his sheer patience and dignity in taking forward the Indian culture. In no other culture, can this be allowed to happen, openly humiliating and questioning the soft language of human life that Sadguru tries to speak. Attending a debate is fine. But Mr. Javed, is too narrow minded to participate in discussion with Sadguru.

5 years 8 months ago

I see ignorance, therefore I see stupidity..... not against somebody but just the fundamental fact alone.

5 years 8 months ago

Why is Javed Akhtar speaking like an 8 yr old ?? Was shaking like a leaf while on stage... the guy is certainly losing it... :-) lols...

5 years 4 months ago

Shivaram

I don't know how he is called as a poet. Mr. Javed is not open to learn what he doesn't know. More over we could clearly see his childish nature as he was talking. He is trying to humiliate sadhguru instead of understanding His message. Personality like Sadhguru is rare on this planet. It takes thousands of lives for people like javed to understand what sadhguru is. He definitely has to go beyond his mind to understand guruji. if he is really dare enough, he can try and see the possibilities of life. As sadhgur said, attitude like when we don't know something that cant exist is mere stupidity. It is high time for javed to wake up from his slumber.

5 years 8 months ago

I thank Mr.Javed Akthar for his contribution on enlightening me in picking a right apple(Isha :)... (India Today Conclave -2008, Think-2012, Expecting some more.. :)

5 years 8 months ago

To start with I am not with Javed Aktar or Sad guru when i
am writing this....Javed saab essentially is against religious people,
spiritualist, communists or everyone who follows a faith system...and he will
also side with the argument that there are hidden aspects mind that is only
getting unraveled by science and what we essentially know of the universe is
just 5% of mystery of it but he is very emphatic in asserting that mind is
everything when mind and the universe that mind itself is a part of is by and large a mystery to science and man..Taking
that us a point what i understand is rationalism itself is a belief and Javad
aktar is just another believe of rationalism...Sadguru tells about evolution,
of becoming something beyond..all that is good to think of but i am not really
sure of...The word Common sense that Javad aktar referred to is very difficult
thing to understand...for mere sake of survival it sure helps me...so my
commonsense tells me to not think of this diverse arguments...but the funny
thing is i am thinking of it and i am fascinated...When i look into myself my
greatest earning as i have understand is for peace...and i sure don't know if i
can achieve it as a permanent state of existence or i will always just be
chasing it....being a believer, non believer, rationalist, spiritualist and at
times any of this...my identity i feel as an existence is as that of a hopeless
actor compulsively made to choose between the various above said roles that i
could never fully fathom...

4 years 10 months ago

I have always said to myself the exact same thing! I really do hope to see Sadhguru in a debate or even just a conversation with Richard Dawkins! That would be so extremely interesting!!!!

5 years 8 months ago

Agree. Don't mind if someone doesn't agree with sadhguru and has a different pov but this guy is plain arrogant and doesn't talk logic. Hence the problem. Like you said may some sense prevail.

5 years 8 months ago

Sadguru's patience was the best part of the whole debate..

4 years 9 months ago

Buddy stronger you are set in you beliefs longer it takes.

5 years 8 months ago

Nice fight between Atma and Mind, Atma Knows mind is argueing but Mind does't have a chance to realise the atma till it dies... sadguru won his mind but it is not possible or end to won others mind... lord vishnu not allowing them to realise because they are not in the way of dharma...life game joyful when we have continuous food to our stomach...nature and time will teach to realise whoever running far away from themself.
sairam

5 years 8 months ago

he is a poet right? my god.........

4 years 9 months ago

Have you heard of Dr. V Ramachandran he explains it clearly what happens in case of Phantom limbs

5 years 8 months ago

I watched the India today conclave video long back. Firstly I didn't understand why he was chosen as the judge. They also revealed the fact that India Today wanted something sensational. Volunteers have to pay a little more attention when getting Sadguru to attend programs like this. It is OK to have a good debate. But Akhtar abused Sadhguru earlier and again now. How rational he was in his discussion is a big Question.

5 years 8 months ago

Had to post my thoughts on this decidedly nonsensical session where the anchor, Javed Akhtar and his cheerleaders in the crowd were (1) not listening to Sadhguru (2) fighting their own mental devils (3) Javed Akhtar coming up with his own "Mind" science of Conscious/Sub-conscious/Unconscious mind and the "gap" area between them. What a calamity!

http://www.drishtikone.com/javed-akhtar-muslim-atheist-rationalist-writ…

3 years 8 months ago

Very true ! any Isha volunteer could be sent to do debate with Javed, Sadhguu is too strong for Javed, It was no match.

5 years 8 months ago

Javed Explaining about mind to Sadhguru!!!.....Somebody who is ignorent explains about mind to someone who realised..

5 years 8 months ago

I do not see difference between what Sadhguru and Mr Javed are pointing out. The only conclusion I could make is , Mr Javed would reach there to what Sadhguru is pointing out with a little more experience.

3 years 8 months ago

I Love You Sadhguru, Tons & Tons of gratitude for initiating me to Inner Engineering / Shambhavi mahamudra.

5 years 8 months ago

I can`t see somebody talking Against my guru.It makes me shed tears some times..

5 years 8 months ago

All we have to learn from this talk show is the patience and composure that HE maintained. This is a lesson taught in action by HIM for the seekers.

To the Moderator,

I feel Guruji must be avoided to be involved in talk shows in which a rationalist is involved as the time now we live is a bit against spiritual people and their work, more so, because of the recent revelation of fake gurus in Tamilnadu and elsewhere. So it will be better if such situations are avoided. We are doing a great work that is absolutely no doubt about it. But because of such shows the name should not be misperceived. That is the only thing that frightens me. Hope you will consider my humble suggestion.

3 years 4 months ago

Namaskaram Sadhguru, does something like Three Minds: Consciousness, Subconscious, and Unconscious exist, and a being , body oooo Sadhguru it's unbelievable , and the survival Sadhguru, Jai Thuje Shiv Shambho Shankara Jai Thuje Je shambho

5 years 8 months ago

I have been thorough the phase of thinking in lines of Javed sahab. But eventually I realized the futility of the mind in case of inner aspects. When I was looking for a way out... Isha happened. I think Javed sahab is on the same road to realize this. The journey I think would be quicker after this discussion. For a creative person like him, I don't think it should take too long.